Software > Renderers | Software
V-Ray for Modo discontinued
Dec 30, 2021 by CGPress Staff
Chaos has announced that V-Ray for Modo is discontinued from December 20, 2021. This date marks the end of sales, technical support and downloads for existing license owners will continue for a further year until December 31, 2022. Read the full announcement on the V-Ray forum.
Being a long time 3ds max user I say Blender will fire all these zombie software included 3ds max
I find it quite humorous how many people don’t realize how large the user base is for 3ds max. Blender is great and all, but there are literally thousands of people, studios, companies that use 3ds max for more than just the vfx and games community. There is such a large user base using 3ds max for architecture, medical, mechanical….etc. Max is going to be around for a very long time and the team is doing great work on it.
Blender is great, but it still has it’s pitfalls like every other app.
I’m all for open source software, but Blender still needs a lot to catch up to Max in many many areas. Otherwise we would’ve switched long time ago.
I completely agree. Even their scripting api from a tool development standpoint is one of the worst ive seen in modern day software. I’d put it behind most vfx software packages.
sure blender will need lot of love from developers before it will be competitive enough for most used 3ds or maya studio workflows. however houdini and blender are great combination for most basic things.
i read this often enough and i got to wonder, what are these blender pitfalls and shortcomings – from a user standpoint.
blender gets pitted against max constantly and if someone could mention a few features blender is missing compared to max, i´d love to hear them.
i used both and although i am not on the latest max version i can rattle off some shortcomings in max as i recall them (feel free to correct me):
i could name more but 3ds max is not something i want to remember.
but thats all i have.
i wonder what are blender main shortcomings as of v3 for the mega pro´s
I looked into the possibility of using Blender in real production and the 2 main things that killed it for me were the lack of Light Linking and any meaningful render pass manager/system natively or even through plugins. Both pretty basic things that I wouldn’t want to give up for a real world project. Arnold probably has one of the better toon shading systems out there btw. The fact is that almost all of Max’s shortcoming can be overcome with plugins. Blender’s can’t, because those plugins either don’t exist, or aren’t close to the level of Max’s plugins.
Light Linking exists in E Cycles and is coming.
We’re a small boutique studio that switched from Houdini to Blender for more generalist stuff, but still use Houdini for more complex simulations.
We pushed blender through a show with roughly 100 full cg shots last year and I have to say the experience was very pleasant, even coming from Mantra.
The main feature we missed was light groups exports (which is coming) but managing large environments, linking / referencing published assets into multiple shots was a breeze.
Cycles performed extremely well with most passes being below 10 min in 2k. For most shots we had 4 layers each with full shader splits and cryptomattes. Multiple bounces and volumetrics too.
it hit about 80% of the type of work we do, and certainly increased our productivity by a large margin, even if it’s missing a few features the turn around time made up for it. Iteration vs setup and accuracy is also something to consider.
But all in all it’s definitely ready for “real production” work.
here’s a breakdown of the work (2-4 people worked on this)
i appreciate you guys sharing this.
it really seems to me blender vs the world discussion is stuck with some arguments that just dont hold anymore. glad to read some concrete experiences as opposed to same ol´ generalisations.
i enjoyed the nordsjøen breakdown, superb work and great to know its been done in blender. fwiw k-cycles(x) produces even better looking and faster images, and truly made me forget octane.
Some of your points are valid some are not, but then we have to first approach things with a different perspective when it comes to Max.
When I speak of Max (or if any other serious Max user does for that matter) I speak with Max +2000$ worth of perpetual one time pay (at least for a few years) plugins and almost never Max out of the box.
This means the following:
Max + Vray +PhoenixFD (or Fume) + Tyflow + BonesPro + Forestpack pro (for those in archviz) and you are set to start the comparison form here (sadly).
PhoenixFD blows everything blender has to offer in terms of fluid sim out the door on its own already. From fumes to liquids to oceans. the quality here is comparable to houdini only much faster/easier workflow.
Vray is advanced renderer competing with Arnold today + the ease of use that comes with it. Cycles now got an extra boost but having the options of Vray and Arnold in Max is a no brainer.
Bones pro replaces the archaic Skinning in Max (but I agree with you Skinning in Max is a pain).
Tyflow is advanced enough to hold its own and I dare say against things only possible in Houdini, it balances it out with its ease of use (houdini ofcourse still being king of VFX).
Max has character animation tools as old as time (CAT and biped) but these alone already beat Blender character animation tools in many many areas especially setup and speed. CAT has procedural workflow and walk system not seen in either Maya or Blender unless you want to build it from ground up.
Biped from the 90’s is still way ahead of anything human IK/Mocap can offer these days plus remapping resizing with more ease than anything i’ve seen in any competing software and i’ve worked in most of them. You need to hire 4 TDs to do what Max offers you out of the box when it comes to character animation no matter how old and how limited it is. in the end it gets the job done with a small team that otherwise would’ve been much larger team under Maya. Too bad Autodesk has abandoned both. But since there is nothign like it out there it still saves our asses in production.
Cloth in Max is very old but damn it produces amazing results, it beats the shit out of Maya’s Ncloth for sure at least in terms of setup time and look/feel. Blender though has some nice tools when it comes to this.
Max can handle more polygons and heavy scenes than any other software I’ve seen. I’ve loaded billions of polys in Max viewport/renders without it dying.
I don’t need sculpting in Max when I got Zbrush. No sculpting app is going to replace that beast of a software and as a serious artist in the field I wont do without it. too bad Mudbox was killed off. So even if I switch to blender I will almost never use its scultping tools knowing Zbrush. (I heard Zbrush might be going subscription if this happens my opinion may change).
I will never composite in a 3d app even if it offers me one I would rather invest in After effects (cheap) or Fusion (mid range) Nuke (Expensive) or Natron (free basically Nuke open source).
Things that Blender has that I really like:
Grease pencil: nothing like it anywhere best 2d/3d magic out there today.
Good toon stuff. But Both arnold and vray have great toon shaders in Max, even scanline has some tricks up there.
Forgot to mention Ornatrix for hair in the plugins.
Cloth in Max is MassFX which Autodesk is putting more bugs every time it releases a new version. Physics in Mass FX in 2018 were unworkable.
Character animation is old in Max compared to Blender. Heck the Blender version 3.0 show off was character animation: check for Sprite Fright video.
Cloth in max is not massfx it is cloth modifier, the same one used in warcraft 3 cinematics and the only one fit for production. Mass fx was a joke and still is.
Cloth modifier is too slow. MassFX worked well in 2012 and 2014
Massfx could not and still cant do half of what cloth can. Yes cloth is slow but it is solid and results are superior.
its kind of funny i guess.
blender gets disparaged as amateurish but when it comes toe to toe, the bastion of 3d creation, max, needs upwards of 2k of investment to compete.
and you forgot rayfire and railclone. i had to buy all these plugins because of the gaps in max.
but its become an absurdly bad value proposition: pay subscription software for the host and then shell out a bunch more for the lacking features. and once you stop paying us whatever we demand, your plugins are dead and the investment is gone.
even in that scenario however things aren´t as clearcut as you put it:
for the price of a one of those plugins, you can have a library of addons in blender that are lifechanging.
going by the same “plugin based” rationale, i can get houdini indie to complement blender and make the case that nothing compares to this combo.
the plugins you cite are all external solutions to problems autodesk will never adress- and they all stem from heyday of 3ds max. it seems to me that addon and plugin culture gravitates towards blender far more nowadays.
max may have better viewport performance but brother that was a long time coming. only in the last couple of years have some legacy max problems even started being addressed. (nothing relating to animation is getting fixed i see)
and sure, one can say, i dont need texturing, sculpting or compositing in my main dcc. but that is missing the point.
its not that i need to go in and do skin pores in blender, but sculpting tools can be used in a ton of ways. doing morph targets on the fly, adding imperfections to models, changing the pose of a still character, doing variations of a single asset, creating a texture colour scheme to be refined in 3d coat.
there is no roundtrip to zbrush, i do it all with eevee turned on in the viewport if i like.
yesterday i took a model to 3dcoat and after texturing it brought it via 3dapplink back in blender with the shader tree exactly like in 3d coat. one click, all there.
compositing can be well used to try stuff out and also spare time going back and forth between fusion or afx and blender. fwiw corona render team iirc added post fx very early exactly because “bunch of people dont want to mess with external compositing and just want results fast”. takes all sorts.
the pro-blender meme here has become ridiculous a bit and in the end the features shootouts dont even matter. use what you like and that´s it.
i would love to get my hands on softimage tbh.
but when i read the blender is lacking this or that, i just dont see it. its like telling me the sky is green.
from where i am standing its superior in every way and is so damn fun to work with and i way past my honey moon phase.
actually one of the rare problems i have is the rapid development so it gets hard to keep track of all the features coming in…
Plugins in max means less people in the team needed to make up for it which is by far the biggest expense in any production. If you can afford it then great if not then weigh the odds. Blender auto rigs dont do what cat and biped combo can. Max also has a million free auto rig scripts.
I understand your points though and i wish one day i can migrate to blender smoothly myself.
What does Blender better than Max for character animation? It doesn’t even have Biped/CAT level of features. You can rrig a few simple character with it. But, that’s about it.
Blender has a lot, But, a lot of them as not production worthy. Dynamics in Blender? That’s a great joke. At least Max has plugins. Blender don’t have any solution.
3dsmax is awesome. Used it when i started, then moved to maya and currently learning blender. Gotta say, its come a long way
Mechanical and medical and archiviz – only for visualizing – and that is also possible with other softwares just like blender is used for visualized for these things but modelling is done by using fusion, solidedge, rhino, archicad, bentley systems’s architect engineering software etc. 3DS user base isn’t growing that fast and most users are getting ‘too’ old. Younger users are learning houdini and blender and those are also growing fast the development of these softwares is much faster than 3ds or maya. autodesk development to these softwares is more artificial respiration than real development, remember softimage, mudbox (still alive – but how long? the have added some of these features into maya but it is more like artificial respiration again), stringray? pretty much same happening to 3ds – maya is their main income in entertainment media products so 3ds wont be here more than 10years that is 100% sure. Maya isn’t going anywhere unless there will be good character and nurbs tools developed to blender/houdini. And I used to be softimage, 3ds and maya user but these days i learn blender and houdini and i love it. I used to like modo but the development has been too slow for last few years. I really loved modo’s interface – it reminded softimage little bit. Also lightwave was at some point lovely piece of software but also lw is discontinued most likely. All these softwares had their pros and cons. Too bad there is no perfect software and if there is something good they will ruin it after all (long development is waisted after all because of money speaks – stock holders = thats the spirit in these days development)
oh and c4d is these days mostly used for visualized things like archciviz – well maxon’s mother company owns archicad so it has good compatibility/integration tools
well you forgat to mention AD softwares are expensive for a normal per
To say one thing is 100% sure, you need to be sure you know your data. Maya is not the “main” income in entertainment media product for Autodesk by a big stretch.
There was a time when 3Ds Max user base was marginal in the movies industrie, where Max was a joke when you compared it with Maya for animation or VFX, or when the only plausible usage was some low poly work for games, and not every game.
I still remember being excited when I discovered that max was used for the ship vfx in “Lost In Space”, the movie, largely because it was fairly compatible with Real Flow.
It does not matter how large the user base of a software is, Houdini was a non-existent software at that time, Maya was only valid for movies animation, C4D was… nothing? I can’t remember what it was… things change, either you stop or move forward.
Personally I think every single user should use whatever they want/need, but in general the artists in the big movies industry are not the ones that will decide what will be used 10 years from now, as long as more Blender artists appear more studios will use Blender, no matter how good or bad is the API, or other things, those are situations that can/will change with the time, even the “Edit Poly” situation (both in performance and/or functionality), but artists evolve and I already know quite a few that had to evolve and learn Blender, alongside their preferred package, because both were going to be used in their studio.
I’m not saying that Blender will debunk any software, what I’m saying it’s that it’s presence in small/medium/big studios is steadily growing, and that’s a fact.
Blender has mediocre everything.. it really is not that good at anything in perceptual… maybe evee yes, but that is about it. (but for its price its pretty awesome)
Do you actually use and know Blender?
At production level?
I wonder how could have been possible to produce something like “Maya and the three” with such a crappy package…
There is a reason why they had to switch to other DCC after that.
Blender is like a cheap Chinese buffet. It has everything. But, nothing is great,
Foundry should merge Modo into Nuke to solve all problems such as fewer user base, insufficient new features, insufficient post processes, and lacking of compositing.
The glorious plan was existed once but was scrapped for investor-prefer cloud-based Athera if my guesses are correct.
i agree – they should. Also Mari should be integrated and kanova features into modo / nuke / mari studio.
And they need lots of simulation tools if they want to compete with vfx industry top workflows and grow their user base.
It’s neither Blender or Max. iClone is doing some great things with facial (and character) animation. They may never be a swiss knife/ all-in-one program (I hope) but they clearly lead in facial animation.
My guess is Blender will try to duplicate this tech and come up short. Blender is a jack of all trades- master of.. well, you know. Max will be much smarter and and work on seamless integration (did I say smarter or cheaper- well, it’s both). iClone 8 will be out later in 2022, I ignored this software for years but then I took a peek a few weeks ago and I’m blown away. It has some short comings.
I still need Max but iClone saved the day for me.
what a strange non sequitur.
iclone is a highly specialized tool, i am not even sure why you are bringing it up but sure go off. its not even that broadly used in vfx afaik.
i wont try and defend blender, think what you damn like. but to think 3ds max is smarter about anything especially relating to integration with third party software is laughably deluded.
max has been purposefully left to stagnate when it comes to animation. when i brought up some needed features up with autodesk way back, their answer was simply: our solution for animation is maya.
i feel sorry sometimes for the stockholm syndrome revolving around autodesk in particular.
Your earlier post, where you list all the things that Blender can do, is like a detailed list of why Blender is so sub par. It is indeed a master of none of those things. You talk about fluid dynamics but is Blender better than FumeFX, Real Wave or PhoenixFD? These are all plugins I can use with Max. CAT, and even biped, are superior to Blender’s character animation system and if you add in BonesPro, another plugin, you have one of the best and fastest rigging workflows in the industry.
IClone which can also serve part of Max’s workflow is the best facial rigging system I’ve see so far. They don’t even advertise the best parts of their tool- one day take a deep dive.
Does Max have sculpting? Nope. Does Blender? Yep. Is Blender better than ZBrush for sculpting? Nope.
I think you’re getting it now. You want the world for free so you get what you get. I’m glad you’re happy. I want the best tech available and I’m not worrying about paying for them.
You just sound jealous because you’re constantly saying your free stuff is better, or just as good as, the stuff others are paying for. Like you’re trying to convince yourself you’re an industry leader with your free software. For you price is obviously a key so you brag about all the stuff you get from Blender for free. Me, I rather pay for the best technology. You’re happy. I’m happy.
When Blender is superior to the many things I now pay for, I’ll gladly move to Blender and save money. I do like saving money. Until then, you do you, I’ll do me. Stop telling me how great your life is with Blender- It’s free. Just think, some people rather pay for other tools than get Blender for free. That alone should tell you something.
lol easy with the projection there buddy.
i paid for a very large chunk of the eco system of plugins in max. i started with it when brazil came out. still use phoenix and fume actually.
i am just telling you how it is. use what makes you happy idfc.
You sound like the kid on the block who just got a red bicycle and you’re constantly telling every other kid on the block that red bicycles are better than all the other color bikes.
Your bike may not be the fastest or the best looking, but you’re convinced it’s the best because it’s what you got and you’re desperate for validation.
Nothing would make you happier than to see another kid get a red bike. Heck you may even start a red bike club to make the other kids feel you are better because they don’t have a red bike like you. And the more kids who join your red bike club, the better you feel about yourself.
I thought you were maybe 12 but if you remember Brazil you must be older than that.
Dude, enjoy your red bike. Let others ride the colors they wish. Know that it is your own insecurity- the fear you think others think your red bike is inferior that makes you boast so much about it.
It’s like you’re saying “My bike is just as good as yours and I can prove it!”
Is that projection or spot on analysis?
lmao no roger, that is called ad hominem.
like i said, i could not care less what you use, learn to effin read.
my argument was only regarding your “max being smart about implementing seamlessly third party solutions into their software”. never happened never will.
if you´d said iclone might get bought out by autodesk and get integrated that way, i´d say that is quite possible. pretty much has been the way autodesk software gets its more interesting features for more than a decade.
now pop-off again, maybe you will hit something this time around. i´m out.
Oh, I think I hit a nerve last time around.
I wonder why? Are people not using it in Modo anymore or I guess not using Vray in Modo?
The fact is this is going to be happening a lot across the industry in the future, the blender steam train is unstoppable.
Why pay and invest in software if you are unsure that software is going to be around in 2/3 years?
my recommendation would be to any Max/Maya/3D app dev to start creating/migrating to Blender, and don’t get left behind look at how good marketplaces like blendermarket are doing.
Yea there might be studios that still rely on Max/Maya but for how long? look at Blender 3 years ago compared to now, massive changes massive improvements massive differences, with the insane investment blender foundation is getting, Blender in 3 years time? pretty sure studio migration will be in full force by then.
If you are talking about small and maybe mid-sized studios, than yes. Bigger studios? No! The R&D spent on a pipeline outweighs the cost of software by a LOT.
I get you guys love Blender. I also love Blender but I would hate a world where only blender exists. Where only their workflow is the one to use. I like having options, I like to be able to choose Max or Cinema or Maya over Blender because it might click better with me. I do hope we don’t arrive at a time where if you want to do 3D you can only use Blender.
I don’t agree with your comment about bigger studios, I agree they have massive R&D and cost is no issue, but what is an issue is finding staff that uses that software, I teach 3D to youngers and no one wants to learn Max/Maya – at the moment this isn’t reflected in the industry, but 5-10 years it will be..
I agree that a world with only Blender would suck, however, that won’t be the case as there is a ton of up and coming up apps that are looking to disrupt the market and don’t cost half your salary..
Autodesk/The foundry/Maxon are all dated, their software is dated, how they deal with customers is dated, how they price software is dated.. they are living in 2010, gotten away with milking the golden cow for too long, and will continue to do so for a while but the days are numbered now..
my personal opinion of course
Great that you teach Blender to youngers (ageism term but ok, maybe new 3D folks be better:) but to not show them how to critically think through a 3D production by showing the total value of other application leaves the new 3D folks under skilled for some jobs and a skewed perspective on 3D creation.
There is lots of legacy as MaruricioPC points out. I’m converting “Maya” and “3D Max” Intellectual property characters that were rigged and have to repurpose for use in games and meta versing. That wasn’t something expected to be a thing 5-to-10 years back. Maya and Max are important to know, even if it is a pass through to move the work to a new DCC. No one has a crystal ball to say what will be right 5 years from now… think back to 2017, we are still mostly relying on using the same tools with the addition of some nice AI things to roll into our production.
I have been using 3D Max, Maya for 20 years + any other new tool that comes along, including always growing my Blender skills. I miss Softimage but that is the realm we live in, tools come and go and we can’t be stuck on the tool we have to be strong in our understanding on how to create and connect and project through whatever the application of the moment is, adapt or die off.
As stated here in various ways, to survive as an artist you have your favorite go-to application and you pick up a bit of everything to not only futureproof your art creation, but there are times when it is just easier to dive into another application and get the task done and then pull the assets back in to your favorite DCC. To see or teach only one solution is kind of missing the point of the concept of what it takes to build problem solve the production of a project.
Yeah, it was my opinion as well. No way to know for sure until we see it. But given the cost of Weta technology bought by Unity, you can see how much money that can be worth. And big studios are super rigged. It needs to be a tsunami before they start moving. xD
i agree in general but wouldn´t be as bombastic as all that.
you do get that why this is annoying to any autodesk users to hear and always results in a pissing contest?
blender is a bit far from the be all end all and some reports i heard from the blendermarket weren’t as glowing.
to add to your views though, a massive upside is the fact that the larger entities can actually modify blender to fit their needs (see ubisoft mixer) and ultimately have more control over their assets and IP too. its a win-win.
Maybe 30 years?
People with Blender make me laugh…
This software is not able to do advanced shader assignment based on paths expressions, it doesn’t have nodal render management like all modern vfx softwares have, it doesn’t have a true transform grouping system that is the base standard, it struggles when the scenes are over a few million polys. Great guys… you can do hobby little projects with it and it’s great but since when it’s even near a houdini or katana for doing vfx.
Now regarding the news, it’s sad but expected. Modo is primarily used for modeling and it already has a decent render that is enough for its customer type. Now arnold is embedded in Autodesk softwares and that every major software has better and better default renders, it will be harder and harder for Vray to compete.
All that you say about Blender… ok, from ignorance come arrogance, but I won’t be the one that will explain anything to you, I will just say that generally speaking… you are wrong 🙂
He must be wrong since he does not use Blender? Oh good lord …
That Blender still has a big performance problem is more than known even in Blender circles.
It is not about love or hate. Not about ignorance or arrogance. It is about if the tool does the job.I am pretty sure that Damn has closely tested if Blender fits into his pipeline. And obviously Blender does not work for him and his needs. And this is something that i don’t hear the first time.
Who are you to doubt this decision for him then? What drives you folks to permanently attack professionals for being professional? They need to do their job. Not to praise a god.
And do you really think you help Blender with that? Being annoying drives people away. It does not attract them. As told below, people don’t want to live in a permanent war zone.
Don’t put words in my mouth.
I said he is wrong and I’ve also said that arrogance comes from ignorance, I don’t care what he uses.
I think his criticism, the points he mention, are simply wrong, but I won’t be explaining why, if you agree with him, in my opinion you are also wrong.
Who are you to judge my criticism?
So you start again a fight with me? 😀
Ah, how i missed the “love” of the Blender trolls.I am the other one in the thread, who is also allowed to speak 😉
You called Damn arrogant and ignorant for stating that Blender does not work for him. Do you know his projects and needs? No? How can you then judge if he is right or wrong? The answer is simple: you can’t. Now guess who is wrong here …
You are pretty offending for somebody who doesn’t “care what he uses” or care what other uses my friend.
Once again, don’t put words in my mouth.
You said literally: “ Who are you to doubt this decision for him then?”
So I asked you exactly the same question.
I stand by what I said without the need to inventing things that others never said.
You want to fight? Go on, I won’t participate 🙂
IMHO he is generally wrong in his criticism, and by extension you are too.
Lie to yourself, but don’t lie to me.I don’t need to put words into your mouth. You did not say it, but you did mean it. I just named it clearly. So that even you understand what you did here.
It’s a big difference to say, okay i disagree. Or to say, you are clueless, arrogant and ignorant. But i will not tell you why you are wrong. I am right, that’s enough. <- THIS is definitely far far away from an imho or simply disagreeing. And far away from facts and the real life. And you repeat your offending behaviour.
When you would have at least some valid arguments. But there is none. You even state that you won’t answer this. All you do is to completely ignore the facts, like the bad performance, singing lalala i am right.
Hot air is all that comes when you confront a Blender troll with the facts. Everything guilty but Blender. Business as usual …
Yes, since you cannot decide nor judge this. But you still think you can. Like you are the dictator here. Or a god …
Now you twist the words in my mouth. You started the fight, not me. It’s you who calls me equal clueless, arrogant and ignorant as Damn.
And you continue as expected. This was already battle answer number two. Let’s have a look how far you push it this time.
@Tiles : To be fair to Juang3D , he is a big Blender enthusiast and we see him often on CGPress, but he is not part of the annoying Blender ayatollahs trolls that pollute every post here ( and elsewhere). Those trolls are doing more harm to Blender’s reputation than helping it.
“Damn”: have you ever tested blender? Few million you say?
Weird because I can run 110million tris in edit and sculpt mode after 130million it might crash/start lagging. Pretty much same performance that modo has or 3ds in my tests scenes.
And also rest of your claims are wrong – no idea were you get that “info”.
But simulation tools suck and thitd part tools are needed. Houdini and Blender are wonderful combo more streamlined when compared to maya,3ds,mudbox,bifrost or phoenixfd or thinking particles or fume,arnold,flame or nuke workflow.
There is new phyics and particles coming to blender and performance is also under new development. And there is taichi and zeno simulation developepment coming. But now houdini is primary tool for simulations and Blender can do rest. Ligth group linking is coming and path guiding and mnee to caustics lots of improvements even microsoft, nvidia, amd, apple, intel, google and facebook are developing new rendering and simulation tech for blender. So lets see what happens in 5-10years.
Turn on Dyntopo, and watch the lag down to 5 fps here and therewith already a 500K mesh.And this is no hearsay. Just test it with playback on to have the FPS counter running while sculpting.
I use dynatopo as it is supposed: i can model (The sketch base of model) to 10million tris before it start lag and 30million start to be laggy. Then i remesh to quads and i can go to about 120million tris with multires for detailed model and bake final results. But with 3D coat can go for over 300millions tris.
Wow, you must really have a power station 🙂
My PC isn’t the slowest really. And as told, the lag is already very visible with 500k for me. A megapoly mesh is already unsculptable here. While ZBrush and 3D coat works happily up to 50 million polygons at the same pc. That’s factor 100.
But the exact values is not the point. The point is that Jakarta is wrong when he thinks that Blender is equal good or even better for sculpting as Zbrush or 3D Coat. And that everybody who says something different must be clueless. It’s a myth, and it is proveable busted.
It’s one of those propaganda lies to make Blender shine. And i hate lies. For me Blender is simply useless for sculpting as a fact. And even for your power station it makes a difference.
Friends, this is a news about Modo and V-Ray. So why do you all discuss about Blender and Max here?
It’s no secret that Modo has a user base problem for quite a while. It is simply no competitor anymore, with a shrinking user base. Which explains that Chaosgroup has pulled the plug. Same happened back in the days with trueSpace when the number of sales went below the cost to maintain the V-Ray plugin for tS …
It was empty for a few days until hOLY pOLY posted obvious troll comment, and despite majority of people who commented being frequenters here on this site, they were stupid enough to fall for his trolling, again.
People commenting here deserve exactly the kind of conversations they are getting, if they are stupid enough to fall for the exact same trolling for 100th time again :/
Even a 9 year old would spot the pattern by now. He posts a single trolling sentence and makes 20 different, not very bright people write pages and pages, paragraphs and paragraphs of arguments.
Yeah, i know. The permanent propaganda hijacking of threads is simply annoying as we all know. And this ongoing Blender is better war makes me plain sad.
In the past there was always a big respect between the communities of the different 3D packages. Since the next job could always mean that you now work with Max or with Cine or with Modo, or, ….
Not with Blender. It’s always this underdog bullfight. And dare you if you disagree that Blender is the greatest software ever.I know what i am talking about, since received a fine portion of this special “love” when i forked Blender.
I don’t want to live in a permanent war zone. I want to make art, not war. And i want to use the tool that does the job best for me. This can even be Blender. But fine if not.
What i definitely don’t need is somebody to tell me that i should use this and that tool and how i should do my work. It must fit in my personal pipeline and to my personal needs. Not somebody elses.
I’m guilty of that as well. And I find it very unfortunate for Modo. I really liked the software and wanted to succeed. Add to that that Foundry removed the purchase of Modo permanent license without saying anything and you can see that Modo’s future isn’t all that bright.
…everything in life i about blender and max
What a disgusting conversation from 3ds max trolls! Really upsetting to read this all in a New Year of 2022.
How long the Administration will continue to tolerate this nonsense?
lol shut ur mouth blender freak!
Well, I read the whole discussion and i must say little to this sad reality. I worked in my past in few software companies – Alias|wavefront/Alias, Autodesk and SideFX. Your fighting about which app is better or more complete is irrelevant. All this gets influenced by people. People who develop or make marketing or make financial decisions. In our past we remember many decent apps that fade out (Lightwave, Truespace, Softimage etc.) All those slowly disappear because of the bad management/marketing and money greed. Autodesk didn’t decimate the source code , they decimate the people who love to develop the 3D magic – Maya, Max, MotionBuilder, Mudbox, Softimage and more. Foundry gets people who had high ambitions (but no experience with product as an artists) and Modo goes slowly same way like Autodesk apps. Most of Foundry folks in Modo team are coming from Autodesk. They were just meetings zombies at Autodesk and today they make decisions for product that was developed by people who like to reach the skies and grow (Brad Peebler) There is not match for creativity, they just want to make numbers, sitting in the meeting room and crying that users doesn’t understanding them. Sad reality. I have no hope for Modo.
Blender: you guys have to understand that product is just a code and code can be rewritten and optimized. Check for example Maya(MAX) installation package. Its a Gigs of data that include massive numbers of code lines with bugs, that are old many years. No one cleaning the mess because it cost time and money. So your lovely apps getting fat. New developers who get hired to code new features doesn’t want to even touch the code, because they don’t know what they will brake, if they change something. So they adding new lines to avoid the old unknown.
Look at the Blender package size and system how the apps is developed. They will catch up with any apps – white papers with new tech are released every year. Blender guys will slowly include everything that is useful. They have the luxury to do any decision without financial pressure of sales. That is what commercial companies cannot ever reach. In time there will be many frustrated artists who will switch to Blender and ask for features that are missing. But where this new way of development will go, is hard to say. Things are changing. The open source way makes more sense than commercial software dev. On the end, software is just human imagination and imagination has no rules and cannot be bought like a love 😉
My Problems with software battels
Artists make art 40+ comments on software don’t do that. Open source is great, but study any offer with skepticism before you pick “champions”. Keep an open mind and if one of them “wins” in your mind try rethinking your logic. Open Souce/free so far as worked best on smaller code projects historically. Why? All of the larger attempts at more robust software flounder, linux has thousands of flavors because thousands of people all want and can do things their way. SO a user has to spend a massive amount of time finding their way, are they better for it yes, are they paid for it no.
Open Source/ Free has just as many failure points as commercial software it is just another way of doing the same goals. One of the biggest 2 problems to its structure is there are no low-level janitors of code and there is no librarian willing to take old code out of circulation because if someone is using it they can still support it and so it remains, but seldom is supported more than life support dead-end code.
If everyone can guide what is to be done there are a lot of resources wasted on what is a new novel, and different things, and not enough time is done on refining as it is seen as rehashing. With an abundance of approaches yes you can get a lot “more” done but knowing then what is the right one for you eats up more and more time, as not every approach has design thought into what ties into it or should be. Who wants to really do the low-level grunt work of Open Source/Free, work that is vital and necessary but will earn the developer real hate for breaking things? Who will be ok with breaking something like updating the normal systems in software for newer more efficient compilers and hardware or mesh description for USD?
TLDR before touting “my world is the best, remember we all are earthlings here we poop and eat on the same soil. Look at what you want to get done and the approach and be happy, be proud of your art not what tribal camp you are in it means nothing.-sorry if this rant is not constructive.
yes I agree – but dont forget the evolution of the computer world – it is very short compare anything what was done before. Time will tell
You started OK. Then, you gave me a good laugh at “Blender package size and system how the apps is developed”. Join Blender dev and fix undo for them, please.
Octane is good enought