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Great for Blender, the more funds the better.
Amazing news –
Best move ever ditching Autodesk and moving to this open-source free amazing software.
Exciting times ahead!
Seriously, what’s with the Autodesk obsession. You could just express happiness for the positive Blender news, but every post has to devolve into Max/Maya bashing thread. I’m genuinely curious.
Eh it not that hard to understand why people hate autodesk, (Firstly they bought max maya and softimage from other company ) there development stagnated they killed one of them and now most of there new ideas are Pricing schemes and rental schemes. Anyone who was a softimage xsi user has plenty of reason to hate autodesk.
I wasn’t asking the reason for the Autodesk hate, just asking the point of constantly bringing up Autodesk on non-Autodesk news for the umpteenth time instead of having a productive discussion about the subject of this article. As I anticipated, the thread is becoming about Autodesk….again.
I think most people have used Autodesk products, I spent 15+ years using Autodesk products and I feel like Autodesk have abused the fact that you are invested into software and don’t want to commit to learning a new one.
The fact that most internet Flames Autodesk now is what they got coming to them for screwing their users for so long.
“just asking the point of constantly bringing up Autodesk on non-Autodesk news” – Well.. I could ask why bother read these comments if autodesk criticism comments are annoying? Its just good to remind that blender is better than autodesk – its free (in many ways – but its good to support blender and even microsoft is good enough to support blender foundation which will fund blender project), it can not be owned by some greedy company (like autodesk which tried to get monopolyg by buying 3 awesome softwares which they all most killed -well they have owned 3d studio long time and it was good at some point but then they got greedy with subscription and they “killed” the development of all these 3 softwares.. and there is other softwares too like mudbox… and its development is dead because of ad). And yes: its good to remind every single time how autodesk killed Softimage development. Also 3dsmax and maya development was long time in wrong direction and their only innovation is rental licensing/subscription. Its good to remind how autodesk is evil – killing softimage, naiad and many ohter good softwares. Its not just for fun – its just for reminding people (new 3d artist) that you can’t trust for AD. And i did use Softimage, Maya even 3DS max before Autodesk spoiled them so its just hate and its good to remember that why i hate AD. Just like Apple and Shake and Aperture and then stop 32bit support and soon after that they say “we are going for arm processors” so there was no point dropping 32bit support from x86 arcitechture.
I can see the long list of Autodesk crimes against the industry. When they pulled Mental Ray from under me for Arnold, I went to V-Ray. But I also think “Milady doth protest too much,” when I hear the rants from Blender users. I think you view Blender as the future and hope for Autodesk’s collapse.
I don’t see Blender as the future and I see them shifting to meet the needs of their corporate sponsors as a priority. DOn’t let the “free software” stuff fool you, the heads of the Blender Foundation like money just as much as the top guys at Autodesk. Blender just had less options as it was a failed commercial product (as was Maya and Softimage when Autodesk purchased them- both foolish moves by Autodesk BTW.)
I think Blender will focus on the needs of those big shots who pay the bills just like Autodesk favored Maya and the handful of big money top studios who wanted it, over the massive 3ds Max user base. And they still wish they could kill Max but first they have to move all those users to Maya, if they can.
Yea, greed destroyed many a good thing. I don’t think Blender is out of the woods, they may be just getting back into them.
Mental Ray wasn’t exactly their fault. NVIDIA bought Mental Images, with it Mental Ray. Then NVIDIA discontinued it in 2017, not Autodesk. Autodesk bought Arnold, and now includes that as a replacement. They could have done much better with the render nodes licensing with Arnold, though. Someone used to unlimited nodes to having to buy them for the same price as a workstation license…
Yup.. Mental images was bought by nvidia :/ Well it was quite antique software anyway but it has great history like matrix where they used sss hacks in esc company if i remember right. but damn it was slow when arnold commercial version was released. Anyway – It was nice renderer in old days. And now autodesk owns arnold and it was made subscription only right after aquistion even when arnold makers said that it won’t be… they trusted for autodesk. Didn’t arnold has one of original cycles developers?
Good thing is that there is multiple versions / branches from blender for example blender for artist – so anyone can keep developing it for different direction by needs. Sure these sponsors can say where the priority should be but thats it.. they can just make wishes for priorities for current development road and but more money for features they want/need but mostly its just for priorities and thats it. Most of these companies has also offered own coders for optimizing code or make it support some hardware like nvidia (cuda) and amd (opencl, vulkan).
you might want to look into that hamlet phrase again, not sure you understand what it means or where it applies.
rhetoric aside- could you please name one single instance where blender devs shifted anything to accommodate for anyone. i will wait, honestly interested.
“…the heads of the Blender Foundation like money just as much as the top guys at Autodesk” – is on the other hand one of the more brainddead sentences i have read this week. and that is saying something in these times of twitter.
if you are interested in blender founders views on money and how its allocated, 26min mark is relevant for example:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJEWOTZnFeg
your assessment is painfully misguided but hey- forget about blender.
nobody is saying its the future, what does that even mean? its a damn tool, and sadly blender users do tend to be on the cultish side.
its super annoying but ignore it, not that hard.
Your wait is over. Blender started out as a commercial product and now it is open source. I’d say that’s a shift to the extreme done to please market forces. You ask where things were done to please a person, my suggestion is that capital, where money the money does or does not come from, has always shaped Blender’s direction. It is open source because it failed as a commercial product. Now it has a found new sources of finance. That should again shape the company’s direction.
The video you linked to has a quote in the title: “Money doesn’t interest me.” And you say my statement is braindead. Unless his wife and kids, his landlord and grocery store also share his lack of interest in money, I can’t see how that works. And, let’s not forget, we are here talking about a deal with a company (Microsoft) that was founded by one of the richest men in the world. (That means he has lots of money BTW).
A guy who has no interest in money taking a call from Microsoft while saying he has no interest in money. And you believe it. Well….
You seem pretty smug in your post.
I think you over estimate your intelligence.
But I will take your advice where you suggest ignore super annyoying commenters You’re right there, it’s not that hard.
funny stuff, i will give you that.
the thing is about priorities – What Ton really says in this interview is that he sees money as a means to achieve true goals, not the other way round (using software development or other activity as means to get more money) I believe it is generally the right perspective, after all money is just an exchange for some things that have real value – like in it’s very essence – that what money is. It is a pity our world seems to see money as some objective and necessity. Plus Ton did the open source move with Blender – for the love of Blender which he was one of the coders not for the sake of money (the financial success of the company wchich “failed commercially”) that’s why BF is a non profit – with a goal to develop Blender as a tool for artists – the basic difference between a bussiness and an NGO. Simple enough and not at all naive. Workers of the BF and assciated entities are surely also earning money for their living but it’s still a bit different approach than a stock market Corpo which aims for profit as it’s main and most important goal.
It’s not annoying me. Knew I was going to get a comment like this. Didn’t read the read the rest of your post. I’m done. Go ahead. Good luck.
P.S. I also use Blender
Autodesk never bought 3dsMax. It was an Autodesk product since 3DS DOS v1,
Was Kinetik an Autodesk subsidiary?
Both Kinetik and Discreet were Autodesk subsidiaries.
No1nja:
Oh my bad.. 3DS really looks to be autodesks product since version 1.
Roger:
Bill Gates is no longer in head of Microsoft.
Microsoft is just funding blender foundation.
Epic has funded Blender Found with 1.2million. Also Nvidia and AMD has funded more for blender than Microsoft. Its still quite low income for developers but they do great job and also these funding companies are giving their support by coding new parts / features for blender. Nvidia: optix and cuda support. AMD: opencl. Intel: open image denoiser. and many other things.. Ubisoft is working something for blender (their inhouse tools) etc. Autodesk and adobe has lots more money but still their development is slow.
Blender started with commercial, now its open source and there is multiple branches from blender and for example Blender for artists so there is other branches if something will happen but which is unlike because of gpl.
Yes Gates is retired from the company and the new CEO at Microsoft has a net worth of $387 million. Whats missing from the article is the amount of money these organizations are funding Blender at and how is that money distributed. Is “Branch A” making more money than Branch B because they are working on an outside-funded part of development? IS Branch A bringing in new people and paying them because they have a skillset Microsoft needs and long-time developers in Branch B, the people who have built Blender’s opensource success feel like they opened the door and now other people are walking in and out with cash?
There’s a lot of details I don’t know or really care to know.
You are totally wrong. 3ds max was developed by Discreet company and then bought by Autode$sk
3DS Dos was created by a group of people working under Autodesk. They eventually became Kinetix, still part of Autodesk, and was only placed under the Discreet label once Autodesk acquired Discreet around Max v4 or v5.
Bingo.
The person who killed softimage xsi left Autodesk. Now he is working for a program that everybody loves. He also seems promoting Blender nowadays. Irony.
OK, since you asked…
Bought 3 (broadly similar apps) killed one of them after stating Softimage’s future was bright.
Bought Mudbox and let it stagnate.
Killed Combustion, introduced Toxik without an upgrade path from Combustion, and then after that didn’t sell, just gave it away with their apps.
Stopped incremental upgrades (you used to be able to skip a version)
Stopped upgrades entirely (you then needed to have a maintenance subscription)
Removed features without notice, and without anything mature to replace them (reactor and mental ray)
Introduced rentals but said they understood perpetuals had their place and rental was not for everyone.
18 months later, changed their mind and stopped selling perpetuals, (despite saying in a video that perpetuals weren’t going anywhere), instead having desktop subscription (rental), and maintenance subscription (legacy perpetual owners)
Hiked price of maintenance subscription so it was substantially more than rental in a bid to force people to trade their perpetuals in for a rental.
Ending maintenance subscriptions entirely next year.
Stating that they won’t even be activating perpetual licences older than three versions old – so all that money you’ve spent on Autodesk product is dead unless you want to rent.
I could probably think of a few more, but that’s off the top of my head.
You forget the one where they are now moving to named accounts messing up workflows and I’m pretty sure setting the stage for the future where they pull some shenanigans with this and extort even more money.
Reactor and Mental Ray were both licensed to Autodesk. Mental Ray was discontinued by NVIDIA, and the Reactor version that was included was far behind the official Reactor version for a long time, so that agreement probably fell through years before and then expired. They can’t include something when the other company doesn’t agree to it or the product no longer exist. This happens with Adobe products as well that includes licensed plugins (After Effects).
Maintenance was still cheaper than subscription on our last renewal. Though it did get a substantial increase in price. It may be more expensive in our next and last renewal if it is increased by 20%.
Every thing else is pretty close to spot on.
Factor in that maintenance subscribers will already have spent several thousand on the perpetual (not perpetual) licence.
It’s more the lack of a heads up on reactor and mental ray – I bought reactor as a plugin, then it got bundled into Max, and *then* it was taken out again.
cheers stephen,
i am in the same “never forget” boat, and your list runs far deeper.
also when they announced killing of perpetual, they actively promoted and encouraged stocking up on the perpetual seats “since they wont be around anymore, so better get it while getting is good”. and then they announced that non-activating clause for older licenses.
if adsk gave out stuff for free i would not even consider it.
truly, leaving 3ds max was the best thing that happened to me, tool-wise.
i love blender dearly but honestly there are some persons here that cant seemt to stfu. its embarrassing and i dont really blame people for being annoyed by it.
Put it this way, I just want people to get involved with Autodesk with their eyes open.
I’ve not used Blender enough to have a strong opinion on that score, but competition is a good thing.
Microsoft also killed off Truespace 3D, remember them? The did the same thing as Softimage, bought em and let it die.
Yup i remember but MS bought Truespace and then gived it for free and killed development.
This time Micorosft is just funding. And its not even close to epic’s fund which was 1,2million. There is also Nvidia and AMD with bigger fund than MS. And licensing gpl – and multiple branches like blender for artist so i see no reason to worry.
Having around 20+ of 3ds (since DOS time) experience, and about 10+ on Max beta, the words and phrases I see from them, haven’t changed that much. It’s always the same, we have an extraordinary roadmap, things will happen, we will have gpoly (remember that :)). Performance is going to be skyrocket, we will have better animation tools. We will have a new super cool UI (Ribbon), and then again with Qt. And all the other stuff. All this since I joined the beta, and then some new manager just axes everything, and abandon features, remember MCG, well drop that and now we have Bifrost.
So, I’m happy to have moved. I do love the people and developers behind 3dsMax, but just can’t trust Autodesk.
Autodesk treats their customers as idiots to milk dry, simple as that. What’s not to hate here?
Open letter to Autodesk:
https://www.dezeen.com/2020/07/28/autodesk-revit-bim-software-criticism/
hi jeffrey, thank you very much for dropping the link.
i have to admit this brought a smile to my face.
used to be, us little guys would scream and shout about these issues few years back. it is very interesting that big players (in the urban/architectural arena even) are fed up with the same crap now.
these large companies are not prone to emotional outbursts and the fact they went to these lengths (organizing together and putting out a joint statement) speaks volumes. ironically, even in that field, on that level, the issues are the same: prices up, software quality and development down, hit to productivity due to issues.
there is a follow up, autodesk apparently replied to it and its as boilerplate as you ever could hope for.
these corporate statements are so generic that you could use them interchangeably whatever you are producing. pure comedy.
i´ve said it before, there are not many companies as vile as autodesk and i am taking pleasure in seeing them flounder and lose ground.
it is a bit shocking how far the ineptitude goes though, still pretty damn funny now i am on the other side of the fence.
sadly, the good people that work there will bear the cost of all these mistakes and greed, and anagnost with the rest of the satans spawn will get golden parachutes.
also i have on good authority that anagnost is that kid from omen…
I totally agree about all the nasty things that AutoDesk have been doing and I’m sure it’ll get worse.
The company I work for (large multinational engineering co.) want me to learn AutoCad to do some simple 2d drawings. The licencing really surprised me. Each day that I use AutoCad the licence server communicates with Autodesk and we get charged for the days use. If I can’t communicate with the server the software won’t run, I can’t borrow a licence I have to connect to get it. At the moment our VPN is under a lot of strain with everyone working from home, so the chances of me actually doing any work is about 1 in 10.
I’m getting old now and will be retiring in 5 years time. I’m really glad I won’t be a user in the future, it’s not looking a very nice place to work.
hi garry,
what you describe strikes me as dystopian. it really is incredible.
enjoy your upcoming retirement, its sure bound the get worse out there.
I wish it was dystopian. But I have to struggle with this licencing every day, this isn’t something I’ve made up, it’s how I have to use AutoCad today. (or rather not today as I couldn’t get a licence).
It gets annoying – the continuous lamenting about this hot girlfriend you had that cheated on you. Very difficult for anyone to fill her shoes, but she really disappointed you after you sacrificed so much time, resources and commitment into the relationship – all that now gone.
Just move on and use all the learned experience, try to trust again. Maybe this new girl, (although a 7/10 and not a 9/10), will at least reciprocate in a way the previous one did not – and make up for some of the lack in upfront aesthetics – if you apply the same commitment to her.
I understand this frustration as a user of 3ds DOS R4 back in 94 – first Max – build 3d/fx capabilities in multiple companies, multiple licenses. Max was young, we supported it, the Max devs was entrepreneurial. An so the way Autodesk fleeced our commitment, took our loyalty for granted really hurts.
🙂 –
Interesting how you yourself diminishes the decision to shift to Blender (in case you did it), it’s subtle but clear, for you max was the “9/10″girlfriend, and blender is the “7/10” girlfriend.
IMHO Blender is the 9/10, max was the tyrant passive aggressive girlfriend that seemed to be 9/10 when you first met her, but in reality, after years of relation, it was a “better not evaluate because it’s mistreating you, and no matter what you think from inside that toxic relation, you will realize how toxic it was after some time when you get out of it”, and at the same time, since the relation was so toxic it generated some kind of Stockholm syndrome and make some people feel bad for “betraying” something that has been their main structure support along the years.
After some time you realize that your life is better and you are happier in general, and suddenly you will understand that your relation with that theoretically “9/10” was fully toxic and was blinding you, it was a poor 0/10 not because how “she” was, but because how “she” treated you.
Interesting allegory, although I dońt think using the girlfriend simile is the best option, I have to say that it fits very well for the explanation of what I’ve been seeing over the last years in some people, and it’s nórmale I think, because we dedicate a big part of our life to the software we use, specially when we are young and newbies, and in the same way it generates such emotional responses, like people insulting here trying to defend a mega corporation that won’t care about them, it also can generate such kind of “toxic relationship” situation to many, where anger, fear, guilt and other bad feelings are mixed.
Not saying that’s your case, that’s something I cannot know since I don’t know you personall, just that your simile pointed out IMO 🙂
Featurewise Max is still 8/10 and Blender is 5/10 imho
Are you sure?
Take out the plugins you have to purchase, tell me what features you think that are not present in Blender that are present in max 🙂
It’s just hip to do that in the misinformed Blender community.
I bet the guy who posted that isn’t even really an ex-autodesk user.
Looks like they are also interested in generating hand tracking data, to fill in the missing finger details that the depth camera can’t see alone. I’m assuming for future versions of Hololens or other AR applications. Man this AI stuff is crazy cool.
No no No NO!
I don’t now are these people trolls from autodesk, maxon or foundry but maybe its good thing to link this https://twitter.com/LucaRood/status/1288840365966057473 to here because there is many who missunderstood this news (even when there is already amd, intel, nvidia etc. who are supporting blender – like they would be “less”… “evil”/”bad” companies) – so – no, ms isn’t buing anything – they are just founding for blender foundation – just like they have done for linux foundation. And in 20years ago? microsoft saved apple from bankcrupt. And there is already multiple branches from blender – blender for artist is most popular i guess. Just in case
they don’t seem to be interested in making 3d movies for entertainment. Looks like they’re moving into the scientific research arena. It will be interesting who has the pull with Blender, the large group of users who pay nothing to support development of the extremely rich capitalist who can pack everybody’s pockets with cash.
MS is not the only company on-board the blender train
btw, they also joined eclipse foundation-
nothing bad happened ( yet… )
blender foundation is also being supported by nvidia, epic, ubi among others.
they are not shareholders with agendas and sway, certainly not in the terms you are blabbering about.
one would think people in this forum would have a bit more insight and intelligence then to spew verbal garbage but alas..
Agreed – and where did he get this info from ? Bizarre
A new interesting detail about this impressive awesome shocking news:
Microsoft will invest only €30,000/YEAR in Blender Development Fund…
Yup.. After Epic’s 1,2million mega price.. that 30 000 is small amount.. even nvidia and amd is giving more at the moment. But all funds are welcome and will help blenders development.
Ha! That’s such a token amount. Seems like they donated just to get PR from jumping aboard the Blender train. I’m sure anything is welcome but kinda pathetic from a company whose owner is worth an estimated $113,000,000,000.
so what? its their money not yours, they don’t HAVE to donate. be thankful instead, every drop helps to move away from adks
Yeah good luck animating at 24fps in Blender and cry about free but noob software.
I agree, there is no obligation at all to Microsoft to donate anything, if they want to donate 1 dollar, great, if they want to donate 30k, great, as Zom said, every drop helps 🙂
Many of us have moved to Blender for the same reasons that the Revit community are openly complaining about now. Interestingly, I found an add-on for Blender called BlenderBIM.
Obviously AD could care less about Vfx as it only makes up a small part of their revenue. How amazing would it be if those design firms put their money and knowledge into developing something like BlenderBIM?
In any case, here is a great article about the issues those design firms have with AD.
Link to the article: https://www.aecmag.com/comment-mainmenu-36/2046-autodesk-aec-customers-demand-better-value